balunasj
:
Hi all - agenda posted to cannel topic - as usual
[
10:02am
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balunasj
:
FYI - update on the download pages on richfaces site
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10:03am
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balunasj
:
I worked with IT this morning and they have narrowed down where the problem it
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10:03am
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balunasj
:
is
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10:03am
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balunasj
:
hopefully it will be fixed soon - I hope
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10:03am
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prabhat joined the chat room.
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10:03am
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ilya_shaikovsky left the chat room. (Remote closed the connection)
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10:04am
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balunasj
:
prabhat: Hi prabhat
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10:04am
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prabhat
:
balunasj: hi
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10:04am
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balunasj
:
lets get started
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10:05am
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balunasj
:
The first think I wanted to discuss is the CDK
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10:05am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: How is that looking - you thought it might be ready today?
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10:05am
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ilya_shaikovsky joined the chat room.
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10:05am
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balunasj
:
I know you were having some problems though?
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10:07am
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alexsmirnov
:
Yesterday, I got first component file generated by the CDK. That looks like 'The light at the end of tunnel', but there are a lot  of tasks to resolve.
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10:08am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: ok good that is progress, what are your new thoughts on this.  The problem we are going to have is JBoss World
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10:08am
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balunasj
:
and wanting to get something out for A1 by then
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10:08am
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balunasj
:
question - is CDK critical for A1?
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10:09am
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balunasj
:
obviously we would want to have it
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10:09am
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alexsmirnov
:
I did not found a way to move subtasks in JIRA from one project to another ( I always got an error in wizard ), so I moved root issues - https://jira.jboss.org/jira/browse/RF-7725
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10:09am
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balunasj
:
I saw that - thanks I think that is a good way to transition when needed.
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10:09am
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•
balunasj
 
another reason I don't like sub-tasks in jir
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10:09am
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•
balunasj
 
jira
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10:09am
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alexsmirnov
:
I estimated efforts to finish CDK part as 3-4 work days.
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10:10am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: ok so first thing next week?
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10:10am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: will that include a mini "how-to"?
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10:11am
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alexsmirnov
:
I'm going to correct wiki pages according to final implementation.
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10:11am
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clerum left the chat room. (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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10:12am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: ok, and that will include a mini walk through for creating a hello-world component?
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10:13am
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alexsmirnov
:
Yes, I can write that.
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10:14am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: ok thanks
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10:14am
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balunasj
:
We'll discuss inclusion with distribution when we talk about assembler.
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10:14am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: in there any other blockers, or concerns you want to bring up?
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10:15am
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alexsmirnov
:
balunasj: Do you mean CDK part or assembler ?
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10:16am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: CDK for now
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10:16am
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clerum joined the chat room.
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10:17am
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alexsmirnov
:
Ok. The main concern is syntax for all our configration elements - annotations, faces-config extensions and template syntax.
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10:17am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: in what way?
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10:20am
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alexsmirnov
:
I meant names for elements, annotations and their attributes. http://www.jboss.org/community/wiki/RichFacesCDKannotations and http://www.jboss.org/community/wiki/RichFacesCDKfaces-configextensions
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10:23am
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alexsmirnov
:
I guess that is job for technical writer too. This is hard sometime to create short, informative and correct tames for such things.
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10:24am
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alexsmirnov
:
s/tames/names/
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10:24am
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balunasj
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alexsmirnov: agreed
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10:25am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: but are your concerns explaining them, or that they may not be correct?
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10:27am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: because we have discussed needed better descriptions for a while?
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10:27am
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alexsmirnov
:
Some old ajax4jsf tags/attributes have horrible syntax . I want to avoid such errors in future.
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10:28am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: agreed - we want to have a consistent
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10:29am
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balunasj
:
tag, attribute, class, annotation, etc...
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10:29am
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balunasj
:
naming
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10:29am
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balunasj
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alexsmirnov: I suggest that you write up your concerns so we can think about them and discuss.
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10:29am
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alexsmirnov
:
For example, I'm not sure, that is better 'property' or 'attribute' ?
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10:30am
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alexsmirnov
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JSF faces-config.xml uses both, and difference is unclear.
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10:30am
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balunasj
:
personally I prefer "attribute" because that is what your are describing
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10:30am
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balunasj
:
"property" is a been term and is what the field in bean form "is"
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10:31am
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balunasj
:
"attribute" describes the specific property as an "attribute"
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10:31am
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balunasj
:
These are good to discuss, but I think we should move to forums for it.
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10:31am
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balunasj
:
Lets move on to component discussions for A1
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10:32am
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balunasj
:
Nick and I discussed what is realistic for a release next week
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10:32am
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balunasj
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nbelaevski: can you summarize ?
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10:32am
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alexsmirnov
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From developer point of view, what is better: '@Component("foo") @Family("Bar") ' or @Component(type="Foo",family="Bar")' ?
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10:33am
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nbelaevski
:
balunasj: yes, let's move on
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10:33am
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nbelaevski
:
Ilya just tested - a4j:outputPanel and a4j:mediaOutput - he says they're ok
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10:34am
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alexsmirnov
:
Ok, let us to discuss. But I prefer to use wiki because it allows wrote out final document during discussion.
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10:34am
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nbelaevski
:
a4j:push has two issues - I'll work on it today and plan to resolve them
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10:34am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
I've started filling cases for richfaces-demo in the project.. It completelly lacks design for now but the cases started. So you could check it
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10:34am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: typically I prefer to use the forums for discussions and then wiki for decisions  
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10:35am
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balunasj
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nbelaevski: ok good
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10:35am
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nbelaevski
:
a4j: log is working also... a4j: status started yesterday and plan to finish today also
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10:35am
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balunasj
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ilya_shaikovsky: I saw some movement on richfaces-demo
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10:35am
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balunasj
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ilya_shaikovsky: I think we need to discuss more
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10:35am
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balunasj
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nbelaevski: awesome
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10:35am
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nbelaevski
:
a4j: jsFunction seems ok too
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10:35am
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balunasj
:
abelevich_ said he can't make the meeting today
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10:36am
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nbelaevski
:
abelevich_: has just returned from the doctor
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10:36am
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balunasj
:
Do you know how a4j:ajax is going  - I know he
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10:36am
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nbelaevski
:
abelevich_: Anton how are things going?
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10:36am
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balunasj
:
has basic functionaliy in
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10:36am
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alexsmirnov
:
nbelaevski: a4j:push needs a some improvement from the functional side. I have had a lot of requests about more close JMS integration.
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10:37am
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nbelaevski
:
alexsmirnov: yes. I'm waiting for more details described in reqs. on this
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10:38am
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nbelaevski
:
alexsmirnov: I've also commented wiki artcile on this. but that's IMO not a matter of A1
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10:38am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: That type of integration woudl be good, but agree not for A1
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10:38am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: did you put "richfaces" tag on the wiki
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10:39am
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balunasj
:
I thought I had the wiki software setup for notifications on all "richfaces" pages
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10:39am
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abelevich_
:
balanusj: I'm working on it now there is a problem with reRender .. when I resolve it seems basically functionality will be ready
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10:39am
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nbelaevski
:
balunasj: that was a comment on the page created by Ilya - I think tag should be there
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10:40am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: ok I'll look around for it
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10:40am
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balunasj
:
abelevich_: ok - it will also be important to explain in forums first - why you would want to use a4j:ajax before f:ajax
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10:41am
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balunasj
:
abelevich_: i.e. what are we adding to it
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10:41am
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abelevich_
:
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
ok so for A1 we are looking at
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
outputPAnel
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
mediaOutput
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
log
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
push
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
jsfunction
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
ajax
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10:42am
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balunasj
:
status
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10:43am
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balunasj
:
+ the core-demo application
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10:43am
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balunasj
:
am I missing any in the works now?
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10:45am
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nbelaevski
:
region is postponed
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10:46am
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nbelaevski
:
we've talked about 8
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10:46am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: yup
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10:47am
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balunasj
:
so can we get another component in
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10:47am
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balunasj
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and is so which one?
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10:48am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
from initial list we have poll, button/link and messages postponed..
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10:49am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
and page
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10:50am
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balunasj
:
the button/link may be an easy one to implement, and is a common and familiar component
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10:50am
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balunasj
:
do you think we will have enough time to get those in.
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10:50am
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nbelaevski
:
when to do code freeze?
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10:50am
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nbelaevski
:
today?
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10:50am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: we still need time do update assembler
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10:50am
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balunasj
:
I think friday EOB
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10:51am
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balunasj
:
then do developer testing of A1 early next week and
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10:51am
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balunasj
:
release Wed/Thur
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10:51am
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nbelaevski
:
then yes
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10:51am
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nbelaevski
:
we can add something from the list
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10:51am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov needed time for the CDK anyway
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10:51am
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nbelaevski
:
let's do button and link
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10:52am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: yes - button and link is what I think
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10:52am
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nbelaevski
:
balunasj: agree - they look the most useful
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10:52am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: and the easiest to explain and for people to understand
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10:52am
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nbelaevski
:
agree
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10:52am
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balunasj
:
the others can take a little time.
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10:52am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
sounds good
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10:55am
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balunasj
:
ok lets talk assembler for the lat ten min
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10:55am
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balunasj
:
I tested it and reviewed it.
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10:56am
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balunasj
:
I think we need to define what the A1 dist will look like
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10:56am
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balunasj
:
and what is needed to be done with it for A1
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10:56am
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alexsmirnov
:
Friday for code freese seems better for me. I would take look to page component if I did CDK part early.
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10:57am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: you had thought early next week for CDK - right?
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10:57am
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alexsmirnov
:
yes
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10:57am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: I think focusing on that is priority
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10:58am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: because we also need to discuss where/how CDK fits in dist
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10:58am
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balunasj
:
for A1
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11:00am
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balunasj
:
So right now the assembler
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11:00am
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balunasj
:
packages rf-api, and rf-impl jars
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11:00am
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balunasj
:
+ the ear/war of photo-album and rf-demo
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11:01am
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balunasj
:
I think we need more than that
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11:01am
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balunasj
:
and not shipping ear's for the demos
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11:01am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
and what about components jar (ui)?
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11:01am
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balunasj
:
I want to ship sources that people can build
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11:01am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: exactly - my point
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11:02am
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balunasj
:
we should have rf-api, rf-impl, rf-ui + -sources for them
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11:02am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
yup
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11:02am
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balunasj
:
we don't need docs right now - but need to think about java-docs for A2
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11:02am
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balunasj
:
at the min
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11:03am
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balunasj
:
Then for examples
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11:03am
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balunasj
:
I want users to be able to rebuild the jars with what is in the dist
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11:03am
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balunasj
:
i.e. extracting the source jar and building
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11:03am
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balunasj
:
that might be tricky
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11:03am
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balunasj
:
for A1
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11:05am
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balunasj
:
sound reasonable goals for A1?
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11:05am
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balunasj
:
we still need to discuss examples too
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11:05am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
sounds good and about examples agree need to talk more
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11:06am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: We'll need to discuss with Alex K on this and see if he can update
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11:07am
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balunasj
:
nbelaevski: for example I was thinking we would only include the core demo that nbelaevski wrote
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11:07am
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nbelaevski
:
balunasj: Ilya is working on another one
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11:07am
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balunasj
:
rf-demo right
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11:09am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: is this the rf-demo app?
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11:12am
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balunasj
:
did I drop off?
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11:12am
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balunasj
:
can anyone see my posts?
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11:13am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
yes
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11:13am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
it's rf-demo
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11:13am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: ok good - do you think that is ready for A1?
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11:13am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
I just not wanted to work under the application where all the developers testing their code
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11:13am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
demo should be stable
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11:14am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: sure, and the example is fine for now.
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11:14am
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balunasj
:
For A1 I'm not too concerned about sandbox areas, but we'll need to discuss them as well.
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11:14am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
Jay.. there I have design issue.. I think I could fill enough cases for components till A1 but what about demo look and feel?
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11:15am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: for A1 we don't have skinning and won't - if it does not look polished that is ok
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11:16am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: Longer term we'll have to showcase our skins and themes with it as well.
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11:16am
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balunasj
:
I need to move on to some other things - we'll need to discuss assembler in forums.
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11:16am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: we need some infromation from you regarding how CDK should be assembled?
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11:17am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
I mean not skinning but look and feel of application in general I could just use one of the freetemplates Like violet rays theme using..
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11:17am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: what does it look like now?
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11:18am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: don't have time to review in detail right now
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11:18am
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balunasj
:
can you write an email or forum post if you think it is ready
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11:18am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
simpliest Y! grid without styling and with cases inside.. Not really good
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11:18am
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alexsmirnov
:
balunasj: What do you mean about 'assembled' ? Is your question about final library assembler ?
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11:19am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: yes and what the requirements are for CDK - how packaged, what is the artifacts in question - is it just going to be one jar etc...
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11:19am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: lets move this to the forums
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11:19am
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balunasj
:
I'll post a summary post of what we have discussed
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11:19am
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balunasj
:
and then you can add details for CDK
[
11:21am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: I'll try to take a look, but can't guarantee I'll get to it right now
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11:21am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: I would say for A1 go with what works, and we can adjust later
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11:22am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
so I think we not plan to deploy the demo before beta's ?
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11:22am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: you mean to a live site?
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11:22am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
yup
[
11:22am
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alexsmirnov
:
Ok. Currently, CDK is going to have 3 separate artifacts ( jars ): The annotations that are used by CDK and project itself, tool-indepandent generator that can be used from Maven, Ant and as Annotation processor, and maven plugin.
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11:22am
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balunasj
:
ilya_shaikovsky: no Beta timeframe sounds about right
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11:22am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
then no problems at all
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11:22am
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balunasj
:
I need to discuss with jboss.org team
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11:23am
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balunasj
:
I'm talking about what we are including with dist
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11:23am
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ilya_shaikovsky
:
Do not be in hurry with checking it. I continue filling cases right now then
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11:23am
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balunasj
:
for a1
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11:24am
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balunasj
:
alexsmirnov: ok those are the details that we'll need to discuss - i.e. what assembler will do that - will CDK have its own, etc...?
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11:24am
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ppitonak left the chat room. (Remote closed the connection)
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11:26am
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balunasj
:
I'll post the minutes and transcript soon
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11:26am
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balunasj
:
and get the forum post up regarding the assembler