[demetrio812]

This is a recent post of Pete Muir about the Seam 2.x support and WebBeans/Seam 3, it seems like there is space for a 2.1.2 and a 2.2 release so there is also space for optimizations:

http://in.relation.to/Bloggers/TheStateOfSeam

I also think the documentation to explain how to make things work faster is very important (like the Dan Allen's article Speed up your Data-Driven JSF/Seam Application by Two Orders of Magnitude) and they have to push it.

Demetrio

[cash1981]

Not even is there an advance training, but the Seam Essentials course suck hard and is really really really outdated.

I have asked JBoss if they will come with an update to the Seam course, but I haven't gotten a positive answer.

[lucdew.luc.dewavrin.gmail.com]

Dice.com might not lie but actually if you compare the following Java web frameworks (Seam, Spring MVC,grails,wicket,struts 2) you will see that Seam is quite well ranked on jobtrends.

Also, now add struts and JSF to the Comparison. You will now see that JSF is massively asked by recruiters. If WebBeans (jsr-299) along with JSF 2.0 are part of JavaEE 6, and Seam becomes a RI of jsr-299, it could boost Seam's adoption.

On a side note, Java landscape has a lot of innovative frameworks and Seam is definitely one of them, it pushes integration quite far. But i also have to admit that Java web market is also too fragmented for recruiters... So i think that sticking to the standards is a smart move.

[luke.poldo.mailinator.com]

Luc Dew wrote on Apr 05, 2009 05:03:


Dice.com might not lie but actually if you compare the following Java web frameworks (Seam, Spring MVC,grails,wicket,struts 2) you will see that Seam is quite well ranked on jobtrends.

yes...seam is quite well ranked, but try this:

jobtrends

I think that agile and RAD system in the next month/year will have another big boots, mainly due to the economic crisis.

[gonorrhea]

I saw Rod Johnson post one of those indeed.com graphs on one of his blogs a while back.

This is the correct comparison on indeed.com, I'd say...

My Link

params: seam, spring, rails, struts, jsf

[gonorrhea]

forgot to mention for my above post, seam is crushed (again).

here is the official post by Rod Johnson regarding Spring and jobtrends, etc.

Job listings are a good indicator of the true adoption of technologies. They indicate whether or not companies are spending money, making it possible to distinguish substance from hype; they indicate the importance for developers of gaining and growing the relevant skills (an important element of technology perpetuation); and they provide a good guide to the safety for companies in adopting a particular technology.

My Link

I know the Seam devs won't like that, but let's try to be impartial, it's all open-source after all... :)

whether you like the man or not, he's pretty much a genius (with a musicology degree!) and now on the JCP executive committe:

My Link

On a bright note, Seam wins when compared to Erlang and Scala!

My Link

[gonorrhea]

This lack of adoption may also explain the need/push for Web Beans.  As Guice and Seam are the two main programming models for JSR299, perhaps Seam 3 (whose core will be Web Beans AFAIK) will be more adopted in JEE shops in the future than prior versions.  It helps to be standardized as a JSR obviously.

But Spring is not and may never be but it obviously has a very high adoption rate.  Supposedly due to its high productivity compared to pre-EE 5 J2EE.

But lots of AOP translates to lots of XML (and maybe now annotations according to Johnson) and I've heard GKing doesn't believe there really is a whole lot of need for AOP in JEE...

[lucdew.luc.dewavrin.gmail.com]

No it's clearly not a fair comparison of Java web frameworks. I have used Spring in many different contexts other than web development. I have also used Spring with raw JSF applications (managed beans directly as Spring beans, or Spring beans as managed beans properties) and Spring with Seam. With Spring core alone you don't develop web applications, you'd need Spring MVC.

You have also added rails which is not Java based (not totally true thanks to JRuby but i guess that rails with jruby is insignificant).

Seam alone falls short compared to php, rails,  Asp.Net but we are not comparing the same things.
php is a language, i could also have biased results comparing Seam to Symfony (php mvc framework). Asp.Net equivalent in Java is JSF (and JSF based frameworks like Seam), Asp.Net MVC equivalent would be Struts,Struts 2,Spring MVC,grails (any action based web framework).

[pragun1]

(1) 2005-2007
- Spring usage by Java world was overwhelming because of EJB2 failure

(2) 2008-2009
- Spring got tough compitition with JEE5
Java world realized the simplicity of EJB3.0

(3) 2009
- JSR-299 WebBeans is JEE6 standard now
- JEE6 release in Sep-2009
- Seam3.0 release in Aug-2009 (influenced by JSR-299 WebBeans and Googel Guice)
- Spring3.0 release in Sep-2009 (greatly influenced by JEE6 and Seam)

The technologies has changed with time and so as the industry view towards RIA and REA, SOA, REST Webservice, SaaS, Cloud Computing etc..

Now, it would be really interesting to compare Spring with Seam